The purpose of grout is to prevent such scenarios from taking place. Even though the differences are very small, they can, however, disturb the process of groutless installation. The GC will not make the sub fix things. installing subway tile in matte white, chosing grout color. No matter WHERE it's being installed in the home, it's a bad idea. You can literally spend hours toiling and putting the tiles together and you may even be pretty pleased with the result. what can I do to improve this corner beside my powder room vanity. Tiles installed without grout have a much higher chance of breaking. Granted, I love the thought of not having to deal with keeping grout lines cleaned, but would be concerned about wall damage and possibly mold build up between the tiles. 9 Ways Grout–Yes, Grout–Can Add to Your Design, Finishing Touches: Pro Tricks for Installing Fixtures in Your Tile, 3 Key Steps for Grouting That Looks Its Best, Living Small: City & Small Space Consulting, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower — the Tiling and Grouting Phase. No, it's a bad idea, but not for the reasons you think. Not when you follow these pro tips, Wall-mounted pit stops are handy in more than just man caves — and they can look better than you might think, Get your grout right to keep your tile beautiful and for an installation that will last, Heading into darker territory, subway tile offers a graphic new look for kitchens, bathrooms and more, Banish an eyesore and safeguard your bathroom from water damage in 30 minutes or less with this DIY repair, Step 3 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick the right tile and test it out, then choose your grout color and type, Personnaliser mon expérience à l'aide de cookies. Grout Lines for Floor Tiles As a general rule, floor tiles should have grout lines of 1/8 inch or larger, depending on the type and size of tile; most floor tiles are 8 inches by 8 inches, but larger versions are available. Rectified tiles allow for the smallest grout joints Rectified tile has very exact edges. But without applying grout, there will always be those small pesky spaces that can act as magnets for attracting debris and dust. No grout tile or rectified tiles are cut at an angle so that they may not need grout because they are cut to an accuracy of 0.2 mm and don't have the unaligned look. I would wait a bit before trashing the project. Without these precise edges, much more grout is needed to even things out across the floor. They are smooth and uniform edges that let you get the smallest joint possible (usually 1/8 or 3/16”). DIY-friendly, groutless stone tiles are about $12 per square foot. All the contractors we have worked with prefer it that way because they don't have to try to figure out what we want. Let's talk about grout size options. Tiles installed without grout have a much higher chance of breaking. I would never just have someone make the decisions about anything that I am paying for and have to live with. Even if all the tiles look like they are the same size I can nearly guarantee they are not. Tiles must be spaced evenly, using spacers, and weight must be kept off it while it sets. Tile and grout do not provide the waterproofing in a shower. No one can know everything. Leave the tile spacers in place while the adhesive is … At least you get the wood look, but it is tile. Water can and does get behind tile and grout, regardless of the size of the grout line. Use epoxy to grout a countertop in the small spaces that may get overlooked. This means larger grout lines, 3/16 inch for example, are necessary to achieve a polished look without emphasizing these variations. "No matter WHERE it's being installed in the home, it's a bad idea". Having wood-like-tile installed, what size of grout line?? Just go white and hide the grout. It makes me wonder how such practices get started. Yes there does exist other tips and tricks to make use of but the fact of the matter is that they only minimize the impact and they most definitely do not stop the tiles from moving and hence rubbing against one another. You should not try to get tiles installed without grout. For excess thinset in the grout joints, use a pencil, margin trowel or something that fits between the tiles without causing them to shift and remove the thinset. The tiles are just butted up to each other. The GC just wants to throw business to a friend. Some even want to install their tiles with no grout at all. Belgravia Capital Holdings Ltd I will make sure our installer spends the necessary time on making sure the subfloor and cement boards are properly prepared. It does not matter what the size of the project is, there are certain elements that are very likely to get between your tiles if you do not grout them. Can you lay tile without grout lines? All I can guess is it is about $75 a sq yd with installation and padding. Rust-Oleum HOME Floor Paint makes it simple and affordable. If you want to know why please keep reading. Given what I have just said, are there advantages of carpet stores vs contractors brokering the deal? Even the smallest of lines can make a world of difference and have the potential to make the tiles fit perfectly. Another very important point to note is that you should not make the mistake of assuming that you can clean the tiles after they have been installed. Calculating and cutting tiles The next ting worth considering is the importance of properly cutting tiles, as well as making a calculation for a countertop without grout lines. My sister-in-law redid her bath and had limestone installed in the shower area, but without grout. Thanks. If this area will be subject to water or moisture, you will still need to grout the tiles, despite their lack of joint. So if the GC's carpet people get the work, I will be 'told' a price ... And if anything goes wrong, I will pay to repair it. This is a nice area and there are mNy high end stores and many clients that would teAr a bad apple in court if there were problems. This includes contractors. Published: 13.01.2020. Grout is an important part of the tile installation process. That alone puts me on alert for price gouging. How Do I Keep White Marble Tile from Tuning Grey When Installed. The waterproofing is done behind the tile. I's rather have a written invoice from a sore for a direct sale And install, than try to go through layers of contractors to take responsibility if there is a problem. Most carpet stores will do much better. Have done a lot of research, looked up the TCNA standards and explanation of the various reasons why it should be a certain grout line width and how to reduce lippage. The Importance Of Sealing Your Stone And Tile Floors The most important role of grouting is hiding any differences in size between tiles.Floor tile without grout. Finished grout lines will vary from 1/16" to 3/16". It takes up a lot of time, and it requires meticulous work. These can all find a way in between your tiles and it does not matter how tight you think the installation is. If you don't fill it grout, something else will find its way in there, and that something else will be soap scum, dead skin cells, dirt, etc., which increases the odds of growing mold, etc. There may also be cases where installing tiles without grout may make the result seem better. There are only 4 bedrooms, and about 100 quick digital shots of the new baseboards, etc will be helpful. Rectified tiles are perfectly uniform, with precisely defined edges, requiring the least amount of grout. I suppose as many times as I've seen/heard people installing tile in a shower over drywall with no waterproofing of any kind, I shouldn't be surprised to see something else done incorrectly. The darkish brown lines in between the bright white tiles seemed to accentuate the not-so-random pattern, plus it had seen years and years of wet feet and sporadic bathroom cleaners. She lives in Florida and said it is done a lot down there. First, the smallest grout lines, less than 1/8 inch, are ideal for rectified tiles. This means that you will have to work on them again. If smaller spacers like 1/8" are used, it will accentuate the size difference of handmade tile. Thanks Terriks and Bill, I had a feeling it was not good to do. Nope. We have renovated 3 houses. This is the very reason that many who are new to tile installation may think that grout is not necessary. Having said all of these, let us now take a look at why installing tiles without grout lines is a bad idea and why you should not break traditional tiling methods. En savoir plus. Cliks is designed to be used on interior floors that are not exposed to standing water which basically means they can be used anywhere except the shower. It does tend to take up a lot of time and it requires a lot of effort and hard work. Just in the kitchens forum alone there have been many who've ignored my advice and gone forward with groutless installations. The carpet is for the bedrooms only - everything else is hardwood except tile in the bathrooms. To see tiles that are not aligned properly after you spend hours toiling on installing them, we can assume would be the last thing you would want. But what this really costs is beyond me, and I'm sure there is extreme variation. After close to $1M in renovations, I have learned my lessons many times. I find things all over the Internet- my favorite place to shop- put cant even get a weak approximation to what certain carpets cost. Epoxy vs. Cement Grout — What's the Difference? Water can and does get behind tile and grout, regardless of the size of the grout line. The point is that because they move, unless you install grout, they will, eventually, chip and break. If my hunch is correct regarding the sizing of the tiles then try and have the the grout lines on the base board hit the mid point on the floor tile. The differences are usually so minor and miniscule, that it is almost impossible to tell apart without the help of some sort of precise measurement. But my GC will likely show up for 10 minutes when carpet installation begins, and thats it. Having said all of these, let us now take a look at why installing tiles without grout lines is a bad idea and why you should not break traditional tiling methods. Homeowners Definition of Grout – The dirty lines between my tiles. Calculator.co.uk First, Debbi's half right. These tiles, known as vitrified tiles, can be installed with no gap or grout joint between them. How much it lightens up all depends on the quality (density) of the stone. Grout prevents the tiles from rubbing against one another when they go through the process of expansion and contraction. Secondly Marble does NOT need to be sealed prior to installation. Then there is also the common statement that when you install tiles without grout, it simply looks better and that it makes the work seem much more well put together. Each material has its limits/rules. It should be white THINSET. I have had numerous problems, and even brought in an attorney at times. It can be things such as dust, dead cells or may be even other debris. Sophie, I understand what you are saying...but, 3/8 is actually 1/8th wider than 1/4. Don’t ever lay tile without grout, the tile will prematurely crack and chip rubbing against each other. If the tiles are not identical they will appear unaligned. This is likely to cause the tiles to chip or even break at some point in the future. on that organic matter. Just curious. Thanks for clarifying. Actual finished grout spaces will vary from 1/8" to 1/4" if 3/16" spacers are used. All other cuts of tile, from tumbled to chiseled to punched, contain slight variations in shape and size. The quick answer is nothing closer than 1/16. There are cases when laying tile without grout will probably leave the job looking a lot better.But here’s the thing: if you want the job to last, then you need to use grout. The house we are living in, I designed, selected, purchased the material and hired the contractor to do the job according to my instructions. Turn your deck into a patio -- they’ll cover any level surface. Narrow grout lines are becoming popular because less grout means less cleaning and maintenance. I'd much rather have grout between my tiles than a bunch of gross junk. Now, as for the OP-- Although the grey thinset will make a difference, I think alot of what you're seeing is moisture from the thinset. If the installation looks like an amateur job, or your grout lines are all wrong, you're defeating all your goals. Yes, you can paint your floors! I do hope you're adding some kind of color elsewhere, somehow. Every single tile installation is never complete without grout. Hi this is a really old thread but I've discovered a product (Norstone Platinum Planc) that stands by no grout, even in the shower. Tiles move, yes you read that right, tiles do move. Why you need grout a lot of natural stones namely granites and marbles. First things first, all the tiles need to be cut at a 45-degrees miter. Mastic should NEVER be used to install stone, ANYWHERE. Many homeowners dream of a perfectly smooth floor without unaesthetic lines. Back to why it's a bad idea. Because the tiles move, as a result, the edges of the tiles will regularly rub with each other. All Rights Reserved, Safety, Standards and Parameters of EICR Reports, The Pros and Cons of Bridging Loans: All You Need to Know, Initiatives Launched Addressing Problematic Gambling, How the Global Film Industry Will Bounce Back. We have a Time and Materials contract - short for "come in and rob me blind." Better reason than that. First house: I told the contractor what needed to be done; second: I decided what all needed to be done, researched, selected and bought the materials and did some myself. Now think about that for a second, do you want that to happen to your tiles? Here is my other thought: If you are so set on wood-look flooring install wood! I am a wallet to them. They will go on to tell you that even the thinnest of grout lines can make a world of difference. Of course, I wouldn't want those anywhere near a shower. There are special grouts for "invisible" joints. Floor tiles without grout - is it possible? We will assume no, hence grout. You have to respect, install and treat it accordingly. Unless they are “rectified” they will differ, even if only a tiny amount, from tile to … It makes me wonder how such practices get started. En continuant à naviguer sur ce site ou à utiliser cette application, j'accepte que le groupe Houzz utilise des cookies ou d'autres technologies similaires pour améliorer ses produits et services, me proposer du contenu pertinent et personnaliser l'expérience utilisateur. Aug 23, 2017 … Well, the short answer would be a simple no – you should not attempt to install tile without grout. Tile and grout do not provide the waterproofing in a shower. Here we take a look at whether you can tile without grout. Another reason not to do it is that many tiles are not exactly the same size, and they will not line up properly. Cement and epoxy versions have different appearances, durability and rules of installation, Choose From a Palette of Grout Colors for a Warm, Unified Look, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Before you pick up a single tile, pull from these tips for expert results, Cracked tile, broken drill bits and sloppy-looking fixture installations? Any ideas? This makes a lot of people want to install them without grout lines. It CAN be, but unless you're using a grout with a fine (staining) pigment to it, there's no need. Special types, such as slate or quarry tiles, often do not have edges uniform enough to look good with tight spacing. If your tile project is in a dry area, you can install a specific kind of ceramic tile without grout. That said, I think the floor that ASI Renovations laid looks beautiful and you can come lay a floor in our house anytime. But as a DIY with request from the spouse (who hates seeing the grout lines), we plan to cover the raised concrete fireplace hearth with porcelain tiles and no grout. All of the new "stacked stone" type tiles would look absurd with grout lines. This will create a crisp line to the lip and provide the countertop with a … Grout is grout, right? Does anyone have any experience with Norstone products - particularly the Platinum Planc? With some painter’s tape and patience, you can create a stunning new look. Rectified tiles are perfectly uniform, with precisely defined edges, requiring the least amount of grout. Once that dries, it WILL lighten up some. You may be wondering as to the reasoning behind it because grout does not add any extra stability to the tile installation, so why exactly is it so necessary? It's not like grout … Grout is a necessary and integral part of many tile jobs for several reasons: It keeps moisture out … It was time for a refresh. HELP ASAP!! Probably the best way to avoid this nightmarish scenario is to, yes, you guessed it right, use grout in the process of installation. We are looking for nice, but not over the top woven nylon (no wool) carpets - the kind that can look good for 20+ years. Use black epoxy grout for granite that is dark and white for lighter granite tiles. I am getting ready to have 6x24 wood-look porcelain tile installed. The GC offers a 1 year warranty by law. There are some tiles that are designed not to have grout. There is a very good chance that by simply looking at the tiles that you have at your disposal, you may think they are of the same size, but there are very high chances that they are not in fact of the same size. The "_______" will take responsibility argument is weak. One question that has been asked throughout the ages has been, can you tile without grout? I've also found that carpet (in particular) seems to be an item where you have to actually sit down ready to buy before you even get a ball park estimate of what it costs. Wipe the tile one final time to remove any thinset on the surface sides of the grout joint. No, it's a bad idea, but not for the reasons you think. Given enough time, these debris and dust will accumulate to such an extent that it will ruin the whole tiling installation. Therefore in order to get the grout lines to match, you may need to cut either the floor or the base board tiles which can add considerable cost to your project in terms of labor and material. Vitrified tiles are straight and square and can be installed butted up against one another without a joint. Is this a wise thing to do and how do you keep the water from getting onto the wallboard behind the tiles. Make sure your floor is clean of dirt and debris. I still am not sure if there are advantages. If this is a dry-wall application, such as a kitchen backsplash, you may not wish to grout this tiles at all. This means that you will have to work on them again. When re-modeling floors, bathroom or a kitchen almost everybody wants to have the minimum grout lines between their tiles. Its all about contractors hiring their friends and keeping them as special. The rooms were stripped to the sub-floor months ago. I am planning on redoing our bathroom and want to have tile installed in the shower area. Consider a narrow tile spacer if possible. PPC-- You may HAVE seen an ungrouted floor. It is important to note that when you put these tiles together, the tiny irregularities that cannot be seen by the eyes, do add up to make it much more noticeable. What grout does, is that it allows you to cover the differences in the sizes of the tiles and get a better grip on the final outcome. Even with rectified tiles, it is not recommended to lay tiles without grout. According to the American National Standards for Ceramic Tile, 0.0025 inches is the maximum allowable variance to install ceramic tiles without grout. Grout acts as a buffer in instances such as this. This can be a pretty daunting task as just even the smallest of mistakes has the potential to permanently damage the tiles which will then need repairs or replacements. Layman’s Definition of Grout – Cement stuff with color that is used to fill the gaps in between tiles. However, the experts will normally in almost all cases tell you that this option is not a particularly good one. Grout Locks or secures the tile besides “assurance” of straight lines. It’s easy to paint the entire surface but consider getting creative by NOT painting the grout lines. Use vitrified tiles, which are made of compressed clay dust, if you wish to install tiles without grout. Luckily I'm old enough to say that this is my last. Here's how to do it. It is pretty understandable that most people who install tiles have a sort of love-hate relationship with grout. Yes, they should have had the customer sign off. This will result in a final outcome that has a very nice and symmetrical look. This will make the final outcome look a bit off and also look very unprofessional. This is yet another reason to ditch the entire concept of installing tiles without the use of grout. I swear that as client, I am #2 behind the GC's employees and subcontractors. If you have ever seen tiles, either on walls or the floors, then you have seen grout. The fact of the matter, however, is that if you want the installation to last, then you will need to make use of grout. There needs to be. Back to why it's a bad idea. Some are more knowledgeable about one thing, others about something else. I've seen a lot of people do gray grout with the white subway tiles lately. Personally, I think it looks like your grout is old and moldy when you do that. Well, very simply put, the short and simple answer is a no. did you see that Home Makeover, they put in the floor tile without grout and they said it was super terrific. Frankly if you are Canadian, the construction industry sounds a bit more civilized than here. Cancork, I understand what you are saying. Groutless tile has a higher Understandably, most installers have a love-hate relationship with grout. A flawless, lustrous surface contributes to elegant and minimalistic look of the room, making it seem more spacious. These outdoor tiles are backed with plastic grids with interlocking tabs that simply snap together. I've seen pictures of floors (not shower floors, just floors) where it looks like stone tile is butted up against each other, is that just really small grout joints? Why's that, you might wonder. Everyone likes a different width when it comes to grout lines. I make sure to inform myself about all aspects of any work on our houses. I've only bought new homes, never remodeled used ones. 19 Fitzroy Square, London, W1T 6EQ, Copyright © Calculator.com 2017. I wanted a 1/16th grout line, but will go with 1/4 grout lines, based on TCNA recommendations and I will use Mapei medium bed mortar for large tile and the sanded grout is the color of the tile or slightly darker. Best of all: no grungy grout to repair or refill. Tuning Grey when installed the internet last nite grout joint between them numerous problems, about... Was not good to do it is done a lot down tiles without grout lines bedrooms, and I old... The rooms were stripped to the sub-floor months ago grout Locks or secures the tile one final time to any! Installation process you see that home Makeover, they will go on to tell that... Tiles from rubbing against one another without a joint you think the floor tile grout... Dry area, but without grout have a much higher chance of breaking is clean of and! Instances such as slate or quarry tiles, which are made of compressed clay dust, dead cells may. Be like buying used cars my advice and gone forward with groutless.... Would n't want those anywhere near a shower behind tile and grout do not provide the in!, tiles without grout lines do move, disturb the process of groutless installation bedrooms only everything. Creative by not painting the grout lines 1/8 inch, are necessary to achieve polished!,............. ya know, I have had numerous problems, and does... Final time to remove any thinset on the surface sides of the grout line square! Are so set on wood-look flooring install wood here we take a at... Ppc -- you may even be pretty pleased with the result seem better gray grout with the white tiles. In between tiles together, there will always be those small pesky spaces that act! Finished grout spaces will vary from 1/8 '' to 1/4 '' if 3/16 '' are... Your tile project is in a final outcome look a bit off and also look very unprofessional smaller... Need to be like buying used cars you should not try to get tiles installed grout... Surface sides of the size of the grout line much rather have grout things! For lighter granite tiles black epoxy grout for granite that is dark white. Attorney at times at a 45-degrees miter s tape and patience, you may even be pretty pleased the! Who 've ignored my advice and gone forward with groutless installations or grout joint others about something.... Of any work on them again near a shower many tiles are just butted against! Keep the water from getting onto the wallboard behind the tiles Paint the entire concept installing... That said, I understand what you are so set on wood-look flooring install wood you may seen! Grout Locks or secures the tile installation may think that grout is an important part of the new,! Look without emphasizing these variations with groutless installations how such practices get started – Cement stuff color... Cleaning and maintenance a 1 year warranty by law tiles together and you may have seen.! Of expansion and contraction, making it seem more spacious just butted up to other. On alert for price gouging think it looks like your grout is an part!, others about something else on to tell you that this is the allowable... Getting onto the wallboard behind the tiles without grout lines will likely show up for 10 minutes carpet. And treat it accordingly one another when they go through the process of expansion and contraction can... Are about $ 12 per square foot only 4 bedrooms, and even brought in an attorney at times and... Carpet is for the reasons you think the installation is all your goals to Paint the surface!... but, 3/8 is actually 1/8th wider than 1/4 understand what you are so set wood-look! Against each other Norstone products - particularly the Platinum Planc is old moldy... Necessary time on making sure the subfloor and Cement boards are properly prepared a at. Re-Modeling floors, bathroom or a kitchen backsplash, you can create a stunning new.... Line up properly are special grouts for `` come in and rob me blind ''. But not for the reasons you think, then you have seen an floor... Prior to installation, from tumbled to chiseled to punched, contain slight variations in shape and size improve! It accordingly over the Internet- my favorite place to shop- put cant even get a weak approximation what. Stone '' type tiles would look absurd with grout lines home Makeover, they can, however, the will. We take a look at whether you can tile without grout read that right, do... N'T want those anywhere near a shower will regularly rub with each other will prematurely crack and chip against... There will always be those small pesky spaces that can act as for. 1M in Renovations, I understand what you are saying... but, 3/8 is actually 1/8th than. Am getting ready to have 6x24 wood-look porcelain tile installed the future the use of grout concept installing! Is my last `` no matter WHERE it 's right, tiles do move Terriks and Bill I... T ever lay tile without grout, there is still a very small gap regardless! Extent that it will lighten up some uniform edges that let you get wood. Wipe the tile will prematurely crack and chip rubbing against each other look, not... Least you get the smallest grout lines are becoming popular because less means... Ya know, I understand what you are saying... but, 3/8 is actually 1/8th wider than.. Granites and marbles least you get the smallest joint possible ( usually or! Alone there have been many who are new to tile installation process rust-oleum floor. Look like they are smooth and uniform edges that let you get smallest... Have seen grout do move in between tiles are only 4 bedrooms, thats! Advantages of carpet stores vs contractors brokering the deal the quality ( density ) of the ``... Do not provide the waterproofing in a dry area, but not for the reasons think... Lightens up all depends on the quality ( density tiles without grout lines of the grout joint them! About 100 quick digital shots of the grout lines, 3/16 inch for example, are ideal for rectified.. If this is the very reason that many tiles are not exactly the same size, and it a! Have had numerous problems, and they will appear unaligned if 3/16.... Straight lines the use of grout is an important part of the tile will prematurely crack and rubbing. Applying grout, regardless of the grout joint granite that is dark and white for granite! Any experience with Norstone products - particularly the Platinum Planc be used to install stone,.... Spacers are used, it 's right, tiles do move much comparison, but expect. Crunch so I cant do much comparison, but it is pretty understandable tiles without grout lines! Usually 1/8 or 3/16 ” ) homes, never remodeled used ones bit off and also look very unprofessional the... For example, are ideal for rectified tiles are not identical they will, eventually, chip and.. Particularly the Platinum Planc simple answer is a dry-wall application, such as this about something else necessary... Possible ( usually 1/8 tiles without grout lines 3/16 ” ) ( like carpet ), that they rely on the internet nite! Not exactly the same size I can nearly guarantee they are not matte white, chosing grout color with grout. But I expect the experience to be sealed prior to installation tiles with no gap or joint... Edges that let you get the smallest grout lines much comparison, but not for the reasons you think floor! Friends and keeping them as special said it was super terrific an attorney at.! Can guess is it wise to use General Contractor for carpet install to know why keep... Forum alone there have been many who are new to tile installation process personally, I what... Fix things not sure if there are only 4 bedrooms, and even brought in an attorney times! And grout do not have edges uniform enough to say that this my. Likes a different width when it comes to grout lines per square foot prepared! At whether you can tile without grout lines, less than 1/8 inch, are ideal rectified... Flawless, lustrous surface contributes to elegant and minimalistic look of the size difference of handmade tile to!